Poll: Critic/director lists that should be official: votes due July 8


#1

Which lists made by individual critics/directors should be official? Choose as many or as few lists as you wish.
We encourage everyone to discuss the lists and explain why you voted the way you did.
If you change your mind during the discussion, you can edit your vote by clicking “Hide results” and then voting again.

See this spreadsheet for information about the lists.

Critics/directors:

More critics/directors:


#2

I voted “none” in the second poll. But if the Dardennes’ favourite films get adopted, we should do them justice and consider them as individuals. They both submitted a list with about 50 films at LaCinetek, so we should adopt both individual lists (full disclosure: which I happened to add to iCM), not the merged list, which doesn’t show their personal taste.


#3

We can always decide that later. I think it wouldn’t make sense to adopt one and not the other, so in this poll we’ll treat them as one entry. If we want to adopt it, we can decide to split them or keep them together.


#4

Idk, They make movies together, why not have a list together? You can easily write in the description who voted for wich film. Seems unnecessary to have two short list when you can have one, longer list. If I’m not mistaken there are some overlap as well.

(Would’ve felt the same way if it wasn’t me who nominated/made the iCM list, btw. I don’t really care about stuff like that :slight_smile: )


#5

Hehe, neither do I. I guess that’s just why you decided to make one list and I decided to make two. :grin:

Personally I find descriptions a bit messy. But let’s just wait and then vote, that seems the simplest option. :slight_smile:


#6

This is a difficult section to make decissions on.
I really like the Dennis Grunes canon, but it is big and covers ground similar to the already official Rosenbaum list, so I don’t feel it has thát much to add to ICM at the moment

Similar with the annual top10 lists of single filmmakers/critics… even though I nominated one myself (because honestly John Waters has the most surprising, enjoyable ánd solid top10 list and I have come to really look forward to them each year)

Susan Sontag’s top50 is kinda famous in my book and would be a well respected critic’s list (and a shorter one for a change too), But how many would really be needing (as opposed to wanting) that list official…?

I think I just go for Waters and Sontag here…


#7

I think it’s worth noting that Ed Gonzalez’ yearly top 10s, unlike all the other yearly top 10s are a) retroactive, not just the years he was active as a critic, and b) get regularly updated. So it really is his top 10 of each year, not the top 10 he happened to see the year they were released as a critic.


#8

I think being updated regularly makes Ed Gonzalez’s list more interesting than most of the others.
I also gave John Waters’ list a vote because his taste seems to be more unique than the others.

I think Pauline Kael’s list is too large, and it’s not her favorites, it’s just a list of films that she reviewed.
I don’t think Ebert’s top 10s should be official because his favorites are already covered in the already official list.


#9

I voted ‘No’ in both polls.
I just don’t enjoy lists from individuals like I do lists that are compiled by other methods.

I know other iCheckMovies users disagree, but there’s not enough of a community consensus about which critic or director is the one to follow. There won’t be a majority winner.


#10

The Grunes list, which I made, has a leftist political slant - which makes it unique IMO.


#11

I agree that the slant is clearly there, but it is still a general and personal canon, not a list of political movies. And i would argue that Rosenbaum has a similar slant… Or at least that their lists are similar enough.
I like the list, but in my voting for lists i am also very much considering what the lists would add to ICM. These remain of course my personal considerations. I do like it when people take time to promote lists they have nominated, created, voted for, and all that. All that helps to take a good critical look at what we want / would like and why!


#12

Here, I generally voted for lists from directors/critics I’m already somewhat familiar with, and that I don’t already have. I’m curious as to why these specific lists from LaCinetek are offered: the site has dozens more from an impressive variety of directors. It’s a great resource but I don’t think ICM needs to offer individual lists. Also, while I, like many others, appreciate a good B (or even bad) movie from time to time, I’d rather have ICM directing me to good films I haven’t seen than to polarizing or even crappy ones.


#13

I(we) chose those 3 because I felt they were the most prominent of the directors and most likely to have their lists be popular apart from the project. If they aren’t popular then I can’t imagine any others being popular, if they are then certainly there are others in the project we’d consider.


#14

Fair point. I think the LaCinetek project is fantastic, and I use it myself regularly as a resource to find film suggestions. I’d be strongly in favour of finding a way to incorporate the variety of lists on offer there, especially as they’re coming from a very international list of directors who (presumably) have some degree of expertise.


#15

I’ve gradually been adding all of those lists to iCM during the last few months. However I agree that there are much more interesting lists from lesser known directors. The problem is: what makes it legit to make those official?

I also added the TSPDT version of the LaCinetek lists, but of course that would just mean more of the same. We have this kind of lists, though this one might have its own accents - it’s somewhat focused on the classic Cashiers’ crew favourite directors, I guess. https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/lacinetek+the+top+of+the+lists/gershwin/

Anyhow, the problem is: what could we do to incorporate the more interesting aspect of LaCinetek to iCM?


#16

Dictionary of Film from Jacques Lourcelles is a bible.


#17

Agreed on all points. Each of the directors tends to draw attention to lesser known films from his/her own language/region, which I think is particularly valuable. It’s also worth noting that there are some directors/films that seem to be quite prevalent on the LaCinetek lists that aren’t often found on film lists, for example Johan van der Keuken or Clint Eastwood’s film Honkytonk. It would be great if we could find a way to bring this content into the official top lists without overwhelming the screen with small lists from individual directors.

Perhaps a compilation of all films mentioned would be reasonable? There are already massive critic lists, like Jonathan Rosenbaum’s (which is also quite useful!), so perhaps these lists in aggregate could be incorporated in a similar way.


#18

I can’t believe Ebert’s “Hated” list is doing so well. Blecch! One bad-movie official list is plenty enough – and that one is “fun” while Ebert’s list isn’t.


#19

For Dennis Grunes instead of his big “cannon list”, how about his top100??
I do like his taste and thus agree he is an interesting critic and a top100 is much more inviting to work on. in this way the list won’t also be similar to something like Rosenbaum’s list

https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/dennis+grunes+100+greatest+films/moviesicheck/


#20

That list should have been official already! It seems a very nice introductory international arthouse list, and I don’t think we’ve got a similar official list yet.